Assumptions - WAS: Safest way to... I   (02/04/00)
	Charles wrote: As a bottom, why would you assume anything? Safest would be to say what you ARE willing to do and say "anything else, let's talk about before hand." Gradually expand the list as you become more comfortable. Starting with what you *don't* want to do is an invitation to disaster. I think that some of this type of thing happens because of the prevalence of "BDSM checklists". While I feel that such lists *do* provide a use, particularly to new folk who might not even *think* of some of the activities on the list that are "common" to people that have been in the scene for a while. The bad thing about those lists are that they're often used instead of negotiation. "Here's what I will do, here's what I won't do. Now...let's go." And there's little discussion about what things actually mean. If both people have the same idea about an activity (take flogging as an example), then ther won't be a problem. But what happens when one's idea of flogging is nice suede floggers that are mostly thud with a little sting and the other's idea is a braided, knotted quirt made up of hard leather. It's not so much that starting with the "don'ts" is disastrous... it's, IMO (not humble, mind you), the assumption that everyone thinks the same thing. Charles wrote: I see a lot of people who approach a new scene with a long list of things they don't want to do, and that sensibility makes me uneasy. It says to me this person is more concerned with making sure nothing bad happens, than making sure something good happens. I LIKE to play with fear, and someone with a long list of "don'ts" is sending me the message "I'm afraid." Probably not what either of us really want. Why does that sensibility make you uneasy? Do you assume that you have to play within a specific box? Or that they expect certain things? Don't we want to make certain that as little bad as possible happens? I mean, if I came to you and said "these are limits that are hard. I can't/don't want to stretch them at this time" That outlines a clear boundary. After that, anything else is negotiable. Of course, I'm fairly specific about don'ts...maybe I just don't understand what you're meaning by a list of don'ts. When I say "No watersports" I mean just that. If I'm specifying "No sex" I tend to qualify what "sex" is to me. I don't *think* I've told someone just "no sex". And if that is the type of thing you're talking about, I agree that it needs clarification. Charles wrote: I find a list of things I like, a shorter list of things to be sure to stay away from, and a willingness to talk works best for me. I also find that the things people say "No! Not that! Never" are the things they're asking for a week or two later. Often. :) *harumphf* I do *not* resemble that remark at all. (Though I've never performed such an action with Charles. :) He's too scary for me....:) Whoops...I wasn't going to go into the fear thing.) I know that there was a *very* long list of things that I wouldn't do...it's gotten shorter over the years. But it takes time to get around them. Some people can do it in a couple of weeks. :) some of us take a little longer.